Sarah Jesudason, Librarian, Multi-creative.

Sarah Jesudason is a Librarian, and Multi-creative person who shares her talents of music, and sewing with her community. She is active in the music community in Oregon, and in this episode we discuss her creative path, the fun and interesting things about being a librarian, her love of music, and so much more.

Transcript

Hello, and welcome to creative peacemeal podcast. I'm your host, Tammy Takaishi. And today I'm joined by Sarah Jesudason. She's a supervising librarian in Portland, Oregon, and also a sewest, cellist and orchestra board member.

Originally from the east coast. She grew up singing in a 300 voice chorus and thought those days were behind. She finds instead that the dots on the page are often connected and friends. If you happen to catch her on social media, she's always sharing some of her awesome creative projects. So definitely check that out from clothes and music and all sorts of things.

She's living a very creative life. Welcome to the show.

Thank you. Thank you for having me. 

You're welcome. We're gonna get started with who or what led you to the creative field. 

Oh boy. I think that  there was a, a really strong music tradition in my hometown over in Rhode Island. Literally this one man kind of built much of what the classical music structure is in Rhode Island still.

And he had a 300 voice chorus, which is still goes on. He's retired from it. He being George Kent. But that, that chorus still exists. I was in it for about 10 years.  It was. not always fun. You know, it's hard when it's like spring break and you're in rehearsals all day.  That kind of thing. But looking back at it now, I'm really grateful that I did that and had that  exposure to that music.

I've had occasions to be in my hometown again, and I'm amazed at the cohesiveness. I feel like I could put on a black robe and jump in and nobody would notice that I hadn't been there for 30 years, you know? So that I think was a foundation of, of being involved with music and being, you know, really loving it.

I find now that I'm still able to call back pieces that I sang as a kid. And see the connections to things I'm listening to now, which tend to be more symphonic rather than, than choral.

So and I think that experience also, that was designed to make music accessible, especially for younger people. And I, I think that that has stayed with me. 

That's fantastic. And you currently play the cello as well right now?

Yes, that's.  I very upfront about being a student ., I picked it up about five and a half years ago and one of the amazing things about Portland is how easy it is to get involved with things.

 So several years back, gosh, now about 10 years ago Portland's kind of the, the home base for something called rock camp for girls, and they do a fundraiser for it, which now goes by liberation rock camp, but it was ladies rock camp at the time. So it was grownups getting together with whatever level of experience or inexperience they had with instruments and over like basically a three day weekend, you have.

Learned a bit of an instrument. You've formed a band, you've written a song and you perform it in public.  So I did that once and, you know, picked up bass and then kept going with it. And there was another session that they did that was all drumming. And I kept with that for a while. And then I was like, okay, you know, middling.

I'm happy, but I'm not you know not excelling at these and they thought, okay, you know, what do I wanna maybe do as my next challenge? And I thought, well, you know, I've been in love with this instrument. You know, when I was in that chorus and we had orchestra accompaniment fell in love with the cello at like age eight at the time.

you know, I, I wanted to take lessons. There was somebody who was willing to teach and I have itty bitty hands and we could not find a small scale cello in Rhode Island in the late seventies. So that, that was that. So, you know, fast forward, what, 35 years later, . Thinking. Okay, well maybe it's time.

Why haven't I, you know, not played this instrument yet? So I kind of my ne my next free day, I went and rented a cello. Found a teacher, eventually wound up buying an electric cello and then buying my quote real one. But. Yeah. it definitely feels like the home instrument for me. My drum kit is a little bit dusty  and the bass guitars are hanging on the wall and they look good, but they, they haven't been touched in a while.

It's been, it's been pretty much only cello since I picked it up.

Well, I don't blame you. It's such a wonderful instrument.

Yeah. there's something amazing about having that like deep re well, especially now that I'm playing, you know, a. Standard. There is something about having that resonant body, like right on you when you're playing.

I, I find it really therapeutic as well as, you know, rewarding to figure out the, whatever is challenging me on it at the time.

You're also a great perveyor of going to concerts. Do you have any favorite.  either artists or composers that you really enjoy? 

Oh gosh. Yeah.  So the rest of the 40 minutes will be no.

 I  feel pretty lucky you know, I live where I do and I'm able to access a lot of live music. I will say it's, it's switched in the past couple of years and I.

You know, I've been going to the symphony and then there's a group of, kind of like a little Federation of small chamber projects that are mostly symphony musicians. And then I had been going to things with that Portland Baroque had been putting on and I'll, I'll still go see jazz and sometimes.

Some pop stuff. And it's generally the same artist I've been listening to since I was a teen for that. But in terms of composers, I'm really in love with some of the people who are, are making these new and vibrant works. Now I had. Intense pleasure of hosting a chamber music series at work with a group and their composer in residence was Rita Esmail who I just, I adore her work.

She is blending traditional Indian classical techniques and motifs into Western. And there it's meaningful on both sides. You can get a lot out of it. I happen to have a little bit of a background, you know, enough of a background with Indian classical to really hear what's going on in that. And that was really, it was thrilling to actually have her at my library and also attend the performances 

from the, the chamber group that was, you know, focusing on our work.

Gosh, Huge. I, I tend to, you know, when I get this like favorite composer, I, I tend to think about the living ones. Despite being on the board of a broker orchestra  I I've one of the other lucky things about being here is gosh, I got to see Carolyn Shaw in a couple of things in the past year alone, which was pretty amazing.

One of which was literally in.  a skate bowl, like designed for skateboarders.  So really interesting kind of installation work. I definitely have favorite artists. And I think I. Hang on just a second. I need to breathe. I'm not breathing. Yeah. It's okay.

Okay. So, you know, in terms of a favorite I'm a huge fan of Reichi Sakamoto, both as a composer and as a performer. I've been actually focusing on some of his compositions sort of working on them for cello, kind of as a tribute.  Because I, I just appreciate so much what he's, he's brought out there.

And right now he's in a process of scoring a lot of his tunes. And I, I think it's a bit of legacy building for him. And so I'm taking those and grappling with them. You know, there's a lot of decisions cuz they're written for piano for the most part they're scored for piano. And so, you know, if you only have one hand that's making notes and the other, one's making your rhythm.

a limitation and decisions you have to make about how you're gonna interpret that. In terms of other players I really enjoy, oh gosh, a whole bunch. They're all. Cellists , Zoe Keating Seth Parker woods Johannes Moser. There's a ton  but those, those three are people I've gone to see multiple times.

Excellent and such a diverse list that you've mentioned, some of whom I'm familiar with and others who I'm not. So I always enjoy digging in and getting to know more musicians that way, too. And of course you do a lot of creative things. You also, sew can you tell us a little bit more about how that's going and what sort of compelled you to do that?

I think I really, really love fabric . And when I can see a really great, you know, pattern design or a texture or something like that, I, I immediately leap into, well, what can this become? And, it's been pretty gratifying. I I'm at a stage where I'm Starting to get asked to soap things for other people, which I find kind of terrifying.

In fact, this the same day that you contacted me about doing this. That was, I think later in the day in the morning, I woke up to a message from a friend saying, Hey, I'd like you, I'd like to commission you to, to make something like this, but I, I want changes. So I want, you know, I want you to figure out how to, how to do this.

And I was like, okay it's slightly terrifying. But  it's something I know I want to be able to do. And, you know, kind of the comfort of having a friend asking you to do it is nice. A lot of my sewing hinges and a couple things, one is

I sew a lot of what I wind up wearing to see performances and in a way, it, to me, it feels like bringing creativity to creativity I can't participate directly with what's on stage. But it, for me, it's a, a mark of respect to be a little dressed up and then to have put the effort in behind that.

So that started, gosh.  that started a few, yeah. A few years back. And a lot of times it's, I get really thrilled when I can combine fabrics in some kind of way behind me. There's there's a jacket on a mannequin and the outside is a denim in this really like lush tropical print. But, but the inside has.

one cotton. That's like all full of books. and another cotton that has you know, various music instruments on it. And it kind of felt like, oh wow, I can like sew a biography in this jacket. I, I like the challenge. I like when I am sewing, I get into that flow state. When I was a child, my mother did some sewing and at that point that.

a more economic way to, to, you know, be clothed. Now it's more of a luxury  because we, we have this fast fashion and you know, things are readily available and fairly cheap. What that's doing to us as a, as a society and a planet. Mm. Might take some consideration. So I do like that more drawn out process of.

You know, discovering a fabric, figuring out what I want it to be. How am I gonna make that work exactly for my body. And then, you know, how does that present once, once it's on me I'm in my sewing room now and I'm absolutely surrounded by a whole heap of thoughts and combinations and.

not unusual for me to think. Okay, well, I have this fabric. That's beautiful that I can't, I can't get more of, and I think I wanna do this with this, but I better do a test run. So I do the test run and then I'm like well maybe it's not that. So the project's kind of multiply like rabbits as a reason result  and my room does, does in fact show that but.

It's still really enjoyable for me. And you know, I am getting that point where, you know, I just got asked to make something. I took some travel time with a friend of mine and I made her a jacket. And it was really, really gratifying to see that it, you know, went on her and, and fit her really well.

I was able to do things like she is a big fan of octopuses. So I found a fabric with octopuses for the lining. And it's kind of like, you know, it's a little secret, you don't really see that. But there it is. And  that opportunity to make something that really speaks to the individual wearing it, rather than this looked okay on the rack, maybe it'll look okay on me.

I think that's fantastic. You're able to, work your creative side and your logistical side and planning things for people and, you know, doing things that are really special that you cannot find in a store,  like you said, do you see yourself sort of expanding on this in the future?

 You know, it's tempting, but I haven't. I haven't done a lot of pattern drafting. I've definitely done pattern adjusting. I think I'd, I'd like to get into that realm. There's some alternative methods of garment construction too, that I'm finding really fascinating and, and interesting dive into.

There's a instructor who

 He was affiliated with a Royal college of art. I'm not sure if that's still. Still a connection for him, but he's come up with a method called subtractive cutting his name's Julian Roberts, and it's such a different way of constructing that I was just like fascinated. And when, when I first found that I, I was just like addicted to sewing, things like that.

In a way you kind of, you take your fabrics and you're cutting. Really only what becomes your neck line, your arm holes. And then there's some other draping things that happen. But it means your fabric falls in the bias and forms all these interesting folds and tucks. And with some practice it's a little bit predictable, but it's also kind of a little little bit of a mystery, what you're gonna get at the end.

And that's a pretty, it's a pretty gratifying. Process, but at the same time, I'm also now finding like, well, let's see, one thing I've got on my table is a jacket that I'm really close to finished. I've got to put on the buttons. And so the lining in place and what I noticed as I'm finishing it is that this shape is being it's in collections from, you know, fairly high end cotoure lines right now.

It's like, oh, okay. So cool. And they're doing, you know, interesting things with the skirts. Well, maybe I can play with that and see how close I can get, get to that or what interpretation I can make out of that. At the same time though, sometimes it's, you know, this is a fairly simple t-shirt and I've got a pair of pull on pants with pockets, always with pockets.

You know, and this would be something I'd wear to work.  Having, it's a nice range of kind of experimental all the way to challenging. I think the most challenging thing I sewed the designer Isse Mahaki actually had a line of patterns that Vogue printed in the eighties. And I found one of these patterns and, and, you know, did a test run and then did the final and it's stuff around the collar.

 That that's probably the most challenging thing I've ever made.  It has this pointed kind of shawl collar thing going on, and a lot of, sort of folded And it's so gratifying to, you know, and I could just pop it on.

 What are your thoughts on,  people taking something that's already in their closet? That's maybe from a regular store and tweaking it or recycling it in some.

You know, I think that's, I think that's great. You know, it's definitely, it beats it hanging in the closet and not getting used at all. And to some degree it's probably a lot of that, a lot of the heavy lifting has been done right. In terms of  the garment construction. So if you're tweaking it a little bit, you, you know, what you want to add to, or subtract or, or how, how else?

So a lot of the, you know, part of the work has already been done and then applying how you see it and how you wanna see it is, is I think pretty, a pretty gratifying process. So I'm always happy to see. Take that on 

the most adventurous I've gotten is taking old pairs of socks and making them as dust rags.

that's the extent of my skills, you know,

but, but they're not going right to the landfill. Right. So that's completely valid. 

 Part of the interesting thing about, doing clothing projects is picking fabric. Do you ever sort of get to a store and you just gravitate towards something like magically?

Um, yeah, that's pretty much how it happens actually.  And it could be.  The print is usually it, or it's a texture.  , the jacket that I was referring to the outer part of it is a wool silk blend.

That's like brown, with little pops of red. And then the interior I used, , cotton from Liberty who I. Phenomenal, phenomenal fabric makers.  and it's one of my favorite prints they've ever made. It's , basically it's nest distortions, , but kind of painterly. And it's my totally my jam for colors. It's a lot of reds and purples and oranges, little bits of green.

, So anytime I run into that particular print, I I've bought when I can   , because not all their prints are eternal. , so I have almost like a little capsule wardrobe of things in that print alone, just cuz I love it so much. , but I know that, you know, I'm. Pretty close to, , being done with my, my stash of that print.

So I have to be careful about what I'm gonna do with the remaining amounts. ,but I do plan on some kind of skirt that will go with the jacket.  It's definitely like the colors and the textures. I'm also a knitter and it's the same kind of thing that, , It's the colors and the opportunity to combine things.

,I've got a sweater going right now, which doesn't call for this, but I ombred it through like five different skeins. I did another project where, you know, it was small, it was a, a piece for around the neck, but I. I wound up using like nine different yards to get the color effects that I wanted in it.

, so it's a little bit of painting in a way, to, to work with these, you know, different patterns and colors and textures.

I absolutely love. And I'm a little bit envious of how creative you are with certain, like hands on activities, you know, sewing and knitting and you also do instruments and things of that nature.

But of course with the creative process, there's comes joyful things and frustrating things. So what is one of your favorite parts and the least favorite parts?

You know, honestly, I think it's the same. I was looking at this question and really thinking about it and I think  having to slow down to figure it out, and get the result I want is,

it's frustrating, but also really gratifying when I finally get through it.  so I see them as both that process, that very deliberative process to get through something is, is both a frustration, but also the greatest, greatest accomplishment out of it, I think not being scared to be a beginner or feel like a beginner is, a big part of.

Letting that creative process start. I, and I do wonder for a lot of the people who, you know, oh, I wish I did this and I, I wonder if that's what it is that, that hesitation to be at step one again, I wonder if that's part of what's holding them back?

Hmm. Could be,  

You had a whole bunch of questions on like library stuff and, and books. One thing I find kind of of funny is I, I can go through a week of work and it feels like, you know, books are kind of the mechanism, but it's really a people  kind of, field, especially now.  A lot of institutions we were closed for a while.

and now that we're back and we have people coming in and we have programs again, just this, the sense of joy  of, of reconnecting with people who wanna do this is, pretty palpable. But I'll get through the end of my work week very often and be like, did I do anything for involving books this week?

I recently had a music librarian on the show and just in general, like I think whether you're a librarian in a public library or a music librarian, just any kind of librarian is like the coolest job ever, like the coolest

I appreciate that. I find it kind of, you know, there, there's definitely people who have that kind of, you know, feeling about being a librarian.

It's, it's definitely a field where you can be a lot of different things at the same time. Which is one of the things I really love about it. It's, it's definitely not a single facet thing whatsoever. And, you know, you can put as much of yourself into it as you wish. Which is another, another thing I really appreciate to me, for me, I'm, I'm supervising a team.

And so, you know, making sure that they feel supported to be out and interacting with the public and handling all those kind of competing drains on their attention and time. And energy, is. Like I that's my job.  Making sure that they're able to do their jobs.

What's one of the most rewarding things about being a librarian.

 It's the regulars who come in, who, you know, that, you know, for them, the books may be the mechanism they get them in, but it's, they're also in, because they're going to have good interaction with somebody or they're going to see or hear something a little differently, than they expected to.

 One thing I actually asked my staff to do was just note that an incident where you're having a conversation with somebody and it actually does not have to do like with the, what can the library provide? This is kinda that evidence, that we're part of their social fabric.

, cause I, I think that's important work that we do is, provide that place and it's not like notes on exactly what was said so much as yes, I had a substantive conversation.  I think that's really important. especially now I'm really seeing how much people, want to connect and, and feel connected and you know, we're, we're a great place to do that.

Yeah, I definitely agree. Libraries big or small, have such a wonderful way of involving the communities and being enriching the communities. And I love that you mentioned earlier in the episode, how you had a chamber group at the library and it's, so not only does that intermix the different worlds that you're, that you're in.

I've been joking with my boss that I want my title to change to music director of the library, but, you know, this is one of those things where, you know, I, I have these things that feel like they're a little bit disparate, but they're, they actually come together really amazingly well. I had gone pre pandemic really very, shortly before actually, gone out to Rhode Island.

 To see family and had gone to the Rhode Island, Phil while I was out there, that landed me on their mailing list, of course, and you know, fairly soon after everything shuts down. I get this email from, from the Rhode Island, Phil saying, Hey, Rhode Island, Phil fans, we we're offering you a discount on this online Willamette valley chamber music festival.

And I'm reading this thinking, wait, wait, wait. That's over there. I'm over Willette valley is where I am.. I I've never felt so like hyper targeted by email.  It turned out, it's a, mostly a husband and wife team and she grew up we're geographic opposites. she grew up here and still has family here, but they live on the east coast and she plays for the Rhode Island, Phil.

They come out here in the summers, and they do a series that are actually hosted in, wineries.  and of course in 2020 had to do the entire thing online.  I got to know this, you know, group a little bit more. they had their performance, you know, you'd. The stream of the performance, and then they'd have kind of a, a zoom party with, attendees, but also the musicians.

And very often the composers and what I saw was that this group was really intentional about bringing in, women, composers and composers of color, and, putting their pieces side by side by, you know, canonical works. I thought, yeah, that's really. I'm really interested in what they're doing.

So I asked like, okay, you know, next year, hopefully we're doing things in person. Would you want to do something at my library? Oh yeah. Let's talk about it. And then, you know, a little while went by and I was like, okay. And then suddenly I get this email, like this has been sitting in my drafts. I'm so sorry.

We'd love to play these three dates. And I was like, okay. Three. Okay. Okay, great. so we started the previous summer, and had these three Friday warnings and. At the time we had just reopened the public coming in. literally did these concerts, like outside of our, our building on the Plaza. We weren't doing programs inside the building so much.

And it was a lot of people who were like, oh gosh, I've missed live music. I haven't had live music and I really miss this the second year that we've done it. It was, you know, almost doubled the amount of people and so gratifying families with young kids who, you know, that it's a challenge to get out to a concert, you know, there's childcare and, and this and that, the other,  and seniors who, you know, have mobility or access issues, or, you know, they're on fixed incomes and not able to, pay for performances, to be able to bring that to the community and, and see this wide range of people, you know, high school students who study these instruments and are getting to see professionals right in front of them. it, it was really, it's really gratifying and we're, we're already like talking about next year.

Um, and I, I love the fact that it, it feels like I have a resident chamber or  group for my library. It's, it's really, really gratify to be able to that. 

That's fantastic. 

It's just one of those things where  these things connect, you know, and I don't know if I would've gone to the Rhode Island, Phil had I not been in that choir  years earlier to be able to connect those, those, those points been really, really great. 

It's always nice. When, when all of the, everything converges nice.

Yeah.  yeah.

What are some of your sort of creative goals in the next few years, whether it's with your work or personal creative goals?

We opened a Makerspace in my library about a year ago. and so seeing how that's adopted by the community has been great. We're kind of ready to start more, you know, kind of another layer of programs besides drop in and learn how to use this. I'm really excited to see where that goes. I'm interested to see what happens with the kinds of materials we're offering. We have a library of things so people can, they can check out a theramin. 

That's so cool.

And, you know, bring things home that they can be creative with. And I, I feel like, there's a thing in libraries where we're always terrified of the phrase, the future of libraries, because that means somebody is doing a presentation at a conference that  may or may not be great. But I think just keeping open to. What the community is going to, you know, respond to and, and thrive with is, professionally really, really gratifying.

My creative stuff. Yeah. I think I am ready to start thinking about drafting my own patterns and, seeing how they work on other people's bodies.  Musically. I think I'm gonna be mapping out with my instructor pretty pretty. There's a lot of the canonical things that I haven't touched yet.

 Maybe it's time to start getting some of those under my belt. My, my method has usually been like, there's instructional pieces.  just, you know, to get a technique or get more fluidity in the figure fingers or something like that. I've been pacing myself extremely slowly through the Bach Suites because, well, it's like the sourdough of cellists, right?

Like everybody was sourdough for a while. All the cellists were playing the Bach Suites but you know, I'll play a bit. I'll get it to a certain level. I'll leave it for a bit, play something else. I'll go back to it and realize, okay. Oh, I see this now. And I see that now.  So I'm using them more instruction  than anything else.

 I  worked on a solo cello piece from Reena Esmail called Varsha, which I fell in love with.  It's interesting, cause somebody has finally  put it into a recording, on cello, it just came out like Friday and to listen to somebody else, play it and be like, okay, I play it slower. And there's areas that I emphasize differently, but yeah, actually I'm doing okay with this piece.  I keep blending those kinds of instructional and standards and contemporary pieces think it's probably time to start mapping out, you know, some of the larger compositions and concertos, I don't have like great ambitions to like, you know, join, join a group, or necessarily even perform in public or any of that. It's mostly internal gratification for that, but I'd still like to, get to another level with it. 

Do you have any dream pieces that you really wanna play?

I'd like to play, Britton,  have, real fond memories. My mother's actually from the same town, as snake maltings and the, the borough festival, that that is my mother's hometown. I, I feel this nice connection to it. I I'd like to have some of his works under, under my belt, so to speak.

Joy in the journey as they say.

Yeah. Yeah. And then there's the other part of my life where I'm, I'm a board member. I think when I I've been on the board now for just over a year. And I think my first reaction was, wow, I'm really a grown up now. When that happened, but, the Baroque orchestra that  I'm with we've had the retirement of our longtime artistic director, Monica Hugga, who was just a fabulous violinist and leader. So now we're in that process of finding our next person. And of course that process is normally a little more subtle, but when you wind up shut due to a pandemic, there's there, you lose that ability to be subtle. So that's happening. we have some other leadership things that we need to figure out and I'm, I'm really excited to see where we go. I find it like a, a unique challenge  to keep  historically informed performance, keep it fresh and interesting.  I'm excited to see, how that's gonna progress and have a little bit of a hand in that. 

 As a fellow Baroque lover. I'm so glad to know that there's groups out there across the country that, you know, are exposing people to Baroque music, whether it's played with authentic tuning or modern tuning, just exposing people to those pieces and that, that beautiful time period in terms of, of music.

Yeah.  I mean, I love it, but I also love love people who are playing with it and interpreting it in slightly, you know, different ways as well. I I'm musically, maybe all over the map.

 We mentioned that you like to do a lot of different creative things. Do you have any specific nugget of advice for someone who wants to dig in more or start with getting into a creative hobby. 

 I think spend a little time observing people who are doing it, but also the only thing that's telling you, no, that you can't do it is you. So being open to , you know, being a beginner and knowing that you're going to. some sense of progress, however, you know, and that, that, that timeline is when you're starting as an adult, , um, you know, it's in competition with a lot of other adulting kinds of things you have to do. Um, I'll never have an eight hour practice day. It'll just never happen. That's fine.

 I don't know how much better I'd be. If I, if I did, I maybe I'd burn out pretty quickly. I'm not sure, but the fact that I, this is something that I can do on a daily basis for, you know, however much time I get. Um, and then the next time I can hear, oh yeah, I figured out that little passage and this is, this is what it is, to be satisfied with those incremental growths, I think, is probably the advice I give, like, Don't expect this to, you know, enjoy it, enjoy it not rushing past you. 

Yeah. That is excellent advice, you know, really savoring and soaking in the learning that's going on.

Yeah. Cause it will, it will bounce back in some other avenue.  just, I can't tell you what that's gonna be. That's very different from, for every person, but it, it definitely will.

 What is a favorite library that you've visited?

okay. First of all, I, I love my own we, we have an amazing amount of stuff in my library that, that that's pretty unique.  Over the past year, I've gotten to visit to what are called membership libraries. So they're not fully tax supported libraries. There's one in La Joya that actually have a music series and they have an art gallery. And part of me was like, okay, would they notice if I just stayed here and just became part of the ...

just started working 

yeah, just started working.  I also saw a, a historic one in, in Newport, Rhode Island over the summer. It was amazing to walk around and see, you know, they, they very proudly put their history on display and like the original set of books that their founders donated, which are under lock and key. And really,  terms of information value, they don't need to come outta the cabinets at this point. But it was sort of amazing to walk around and think. This is the library. I work in a library, these buildings feel so very, very different.  It's amazing that we use the same word.  I've, been to Seattle's main one, which is kind of an architectural Marvel. There's the central library and Stockholm, which every time you see some article about libraries and they're showing a curved wall of books, that's from that building. I think what was gratifying there was to. Yes, architecturally. It's, it's a wonderful building, but it's being used as a very normal library. They're not just, here's the architecture. Oh, by the way, we're also a library. It was, it's a very living, breathing, you know, story time is at this time in this room with this amazing mural, kind of place. So, I tend to, when I, when I'm, in a more standard library I'm looking for things like, you know, what kind of programs are they putting on? What did their print pieces and their publicity looks like? is there anything about how they've laid out their space or their signage or things like that?

You know, that I can, that I can borrow. So, I mean, the books are gonna be kind of similar unless it's a special specialty library. I'm kind of looking for, how did they make this place feel and how are they talking to their community? And what, what can I learn from that?

Excellent. Are, are there any libraries that are sort of on your bucket list to visit?

Not really. When I travel, I tend to look at like, what's the live music I can go here and what's the museums. I may or may not go to the library. Bookstores. I know lots of librarians who, you know, automatically go to the bookstores. And I, I find actually I get a little bit of anxiety when I do, because what they have on the table is new is something that I read about like four to six months ahead of, and order probably ordered from my library. When it's there, like, oh, this is new. Did I, did I remember to order this? You know, I. It's not relaxing.  for me,  in that environment. I'm wondering if I've, you know, made the right decisions. Um, I'm, I'm still buying all the adult nonfiction,  at my library. I'm better off with bookstores knowing exactly what it is that I want rather, because if I go in and browse, it just. That difference in time between learning about a publication and having it as part of your collection. In the meanwhile you've learned about more stuff, that's coming, more stuff that's coming. And so when you're you're faced with something that's new, but in your head, it's six months old already.

It's not fun for me I don't enjoy that. Librarianship does change your relationship with books quite a bit I think a lot of us go into the field because, you know, we were strong readers growing up. I know for me,  choir rehearsal was twice a week. Well, Mondays and Fridays. Then of course over the weekend, but, the public library, my hometown was across from the church where rehearsals were and the choir master very, very wisely rehearsed the boys choir first because you don't want those board kids running around your under craft which meant, you know, had an hour and or so.

so I was at the library until it was time. And I, sometimes I think that's how I wound up as a librarian. , having that sense of, of space there.  They've renovated that library,  cause they had to for, for ADA purposes. But when I was a kid, like all the adult nonfiction was downstairs, I knew where the art books were.

I knew where the mythology books were. I knew where the architecture books were. You know, that was my playground.  I still think that, you know, that that feeling of this is my place to go and explore is probably what led me into the field. 

That's really wonderful. And it sounds like it created some great memories.

Yeah.  I do remember like I'm, I'm old enough that at the time the library gave out different youth and adult cards  and if you had a youth card, you were, you know, restricted to the youth collection, an adult card, you could check out anything. There really was not young adult literature at the time. I remember my parents having to go and argue to get me a full access card because my reading level was, you know, able to support it.  I remember going through the adult fiction, like pretty much alphabetically which, you know, so I gravitated to science fiction mostly, but it was all all blended, but I, I remember, you know, picking up the ASM off and Bradberry and Frank Herbert and, but since we were doing things alphabetically, I, I read the Handmaid's tale when I was about 13. Maybe not the wisest choice of, of age to read that book, but I think definitely gave me that sense of, yeah. There's. power in these stories, it's not just, you know, passing time.

Did you have a specific favorite book that you would return to reading?

I ate through the Dune series when I was in middle school or at least all the ones that existed at that point.  Really kind of fascinated with it. And I, I find it funny now, cause I still I'm terrible at watching movies. I still haven't watched the new adaptation but there's some iconic iconic things in the, those stories that I still can recognize when people are, are talking about them.

 It's pretty rare for me to reread a book. I always have a fairly ridiculous to be read pile. I also give myself a lot of permission to not finish, like, get a taste, you know, if something drags me in and I have to finish it, that's, that's wonderful. That's absolutely wonderful. There's a lot that I'm gonna get to my, like, I, I try to give a book about 30 pages to convince me to read anymore, but I've let go of the guilt of not finishing cause it has to get back on the shelf for other people to enjoy.

What is the biggest sector of creative arts or, the library field that you're curious about right now? 

Mm. Um, I think people's relationships with these institutions have changed. I partially from being closed during the pandemic and people figuring out where these fit back into their lives. , I've heard from a lot of people who feel like they can't read as much, other people who deep dive into reading, And what we know right now, like statistics wise at my library. We have fewer people coming in the door, but we have almost the same amount of material checking out, which means our super readers are back. Our more casual readers haven't figured out how to re. Reintegrate us yet. We need to figure out how to talk to the people who aren't coming in the door as much.

 I think that's actually happening in the performing arts as well. There's, you know, maybe I'm a super listener, so to speak, cause I'm at a concert maybe once a week. When there are other people who, who aren't feeling comfortable yet about going into the hall, so I, I think that challenge of reconnecting is definitely present in both, both spheres. you know, we've had some  luck and opportunity in being able to do things online, but I know once you start having, you know, both in person. Stuff happening then that that's where you need to put your capacity towards. It might be slightly easier for performing arts, you know, to have the thing filmed. but I think for the people who really missed it, that, that, that isn't quite as gratifying as being able to see it live so

 We're gonna leave with one more question. And it's the hallmark one and it's in your own words, what does living a creative life mean to you?

I think it is finding the connections and the integrations, that the learning and discovering and mastering of a scale is, something we should all be trying to do and that it's going to bring a lot of. Depth and enjoyment and yeah. And just plain joy, to the other parts of your life.  That, that it does not live siloed.

Excellent. I love that. Is there anything else you'd like to, impart to our listeners before we go? 

in looking at some of the, the prompts and questions of this, there is, describing myself in one word it's unabashed. I just, I don't see the point in spending a lot of energy hiding enthusiasms and just, just living with them and expressing them, is a it's it's warfare to yourself it is so much easier to find community when you do that. And you're not hiding that. and you know, who, who doesn't wanna live with, you know, joy, don't be scared of it. 

Yeah. Yeah. Excellent. Sarah, it has been an absolute pleasure getting to know you and being able to talk more about your wonderful and creative passions. Listeners, please check out the show notes and give Sarah a shout out on social media, because she's really doing some amazing things. And as always, thanks for listening.